In a landlord-tenant scenario, the renter typically pays for some or all utility bills while maintenance issues are usually the owner’s responsibility.

That’s not the case with the Eureka Springs Auditorium, according to members of the city advertising and promotion commission, and they want to know why.

During a workshop to continue budget talks for 2026, commissioners again lamented over what the CAPC is responsible for paying as renters of The Aud, a city-owned building.

“Could you please remind me, what is the agreement with the city?” commissioner Heather Wilson asked. “So, I see things that completely seem reasonable to me that the CAPC would pay for, like well, you know, all the meetings happen here, but electricity, for instance. If I lease a place, I have to pay the electricity, or I might have to pay the water, but there are quite a few things here that usually your landlord would pay. Why are we paying those things?”

It’s not an easy question to answer, CAPC executive director Mike Maloney said.

“That’s a very tough question, and it goes back to, I believe, the time the CAPC moved [offices] from …. Van Buren down here [to The Aud],” Maloney said. “At a meeting there was discussion between city council and whoever was representing the CAPC at the time … that the CAPC would move into the offices up here and they would maintain the building. Now, I don’t know, and I have never seen an agreement, per se, that was executed as a legal agreement or a document that would suggest this is what, who does what.”

A document was created with an attorney two years ago and presented to the city, but Maloney said “it really didn’t go anywhere.”

“I think there was a couple of reasons perhaps it did not,” he said. “It wasn’t specific enough to really outline who was responsible for what, and then the other part of that is it really didn’t have an opportunity to go to the city council for discussion.

“So, I think where we’re at at this point is some delineation between, I guess, the occupancy of the CAPC in this building, and what that means, and if we were to move out of The Auditorium, would we be back to where we were, for instance, in 2019? I don’t know the answer to that question.” Commissioners said that since The Aud is used to host meetings of every city commission, plus other city gatherings, the CAPC shouldn’t be responsible for repairs such as to the HVAC system, or footing the entire bill for fiber optic wifi to help broadcast those meetings on YouTube.

In fact, CAPC finance director Ty Reed told commissioners when looking at The Aud’s costs on the yearly budget, almost $14,000 was the difference in the utility bills after the internet upgrade.

“What we’ve done is there is an analysis that Ty has put together on Auditorium profit-loss and so forth that we can take a look at,” Maloney said. “I think where we stand at this point probably is to request a more formal meeting with the mayor and finance director to really discuss those. That should be done, I think, in a workshop format, and that way we can sit down and say this money that’s being expended by the CAPC is a tremendous amount of money and the city does own the building.

“If something happens, for instance, the elevator doesn’t work right now. Well, the city’s going to take care of that. That’s good news, but there’s those other little situations that come up like the HVAC. When it breaks down it’s very expensive to fix. The units are past their actual life cycle, could stand to be replaced, and they will fail again. It’s just the nature of the beast. So, I think a workshop is probably imminent …” Commissioners agreed discussing the issue with the city was needed.

“… Just for transparency for public who may be watching or will tune in, the last 12 months of general operations has been $138,553.30 for the CAPC,” Wilson said. “And those are under three categories: maintenance, upgrades, and utilities. With all of the public meetings taking place here, it being owned by the city, I think that that would be wise to have a workshop.

“I don’t think the CAPC should pay $31,000 almost for heat and air. I think that’s unreasonable that the CAPC is expected to foot that bill. Again, I think there’s some things that are perfectly reasonable here, but others, just a renovation payment for a city-owned building of $44,000? The city should have footed that.

“So, hopefully… that conversation could lead to a reduction in these bills.”

Commissioner Robert Schmid said he’s always been vocal about the issue, and even suggested that the CAPC should look into available office space elsewhere.

“At some point, I would really see and say, look, ‘you know what? We’ll just find some office space.’ And I’m sure if we would go probably $2,500 a month, we could probably get a nice office space somewhere, and just see what happens if we stop maintaining this building,” Schmid said. “Legally, I don’t think we are obligated to maintain and pay all the bills for this building, it’s just an old tradition, I guess, that the CAPC was the money pit, or pot, but for us, it’s a pit.

“… At some point, I can understand if we stay here that we pay for utilities at some point, but I don’t understand that we have to pay for upgrades or repairs. It is the owner of the building who should pay for repairs and upkeep. …” Commission vice chair Shira Fouste, who was leading the workshop in the absence of chair Steve Holifield, said indepth discussions about any relocation should wait until more information is obtained about what was agreed upon when the CAPC office moved to The Aud.

“I do think Mike is right about setting up a workshop so we can discuss with the mayor and kind of get an idea of where we stand legally, and things like that will make a big difference,” Fouste said. “I’m not sure that it’s something we can really hash out at this time. Plus, I think there’s also factors that we’d wanna talk with … the crew about like visibility, because I know in 2019, for example, when the CAPC was located in the same building as The Eureka Market, in the back it was not very visible to tourists in any way. … I think it was even hard to find us as a business owner, so I do think there are some advantages to being right here on the main drag. I think all of that probably needs to be toggled over, and advantages and disadvantages need to be looked at.”

Schmid agreed. “The location of the whole office and everything, office space, it’s ideal to be in the center and be on the pulse of what’s going on, and have the staff here in town so they can actually see what’s happening,” he said. “I mean, that’s a cool effect.

“I would just be open-minded to keep an eye open on available office space in a desirable location …”

OTHER BUDGET ITEMS The CAPC continued to discuss various aspects of the proposed budget, which now includes a 3 percent pay raise for staff at the urging of some commissioners, specifically Wilson, who says she thinks there’s still plenty of money in the bank to give employee bonuses.

“We did increase payroll by, we gave a 3 percent increase with, but no bonus, so we did do a 3 percent increase on payroll,” Reed said. “To make up for some of it, we reduced a little bit of marketing expense and we reduced some group sales expenses too,” Maloney told commissioners that discussions with Madden Media went well regarding trimming the agency budget to $750,000.

“They’ll be coming back to us probably by the end of the month … with an amended budget and their suggestions,” he said.

Commissioners again discussed with Maloney about bringing most concerts and other type of shows at The Aud in-house instead of relying on promoters.

Maloney said he’d like to branch out to artists of various genres of music that appeal to a broader audience of various age groups.

“In other words, we’re not bringing in Gen-Z talent, we’re not bringing in even Gen-Y talent,” Maloney said of most of the recent acts over the past couple of years that have come to The Aud. “You know, we are still bringing in baby boomer talent, and that is an audience of gray hairs, and the numbers are dwindling in those marketplaces. …” Commissioner Coltan Scrivner said if The Aud is going to be an entertainment venue run by staff, he suggest that it have its own dedicated website showing more photos and videos of the facility and history of past acts to help draw the interest of talent.

“If I was a promoter and I had a thousand- seat auditorium, but I saw that it didn’t have its own independent website, I would feel a little cautious in booking that,” Scrivner said, acknowledging that The Aud does have a page on the CAPC website. “The page is set up nicely, but there’s like one photo of The Aud. There’s no examples of what kind of shows we have, as far as photo reels or videos or any kind of actual promotion of what The Aud can do …” Maloney said at one time The Aud did have a “very robust website.”

“It went through the history of all things here, and when a different agency came in, they just shelved, and consequently it’s been kind of put on the back burner up to a point where it needs to come back up, because we’ve got a great history,” he said. “We have tremendous footage, we’ve got all kinds of pictures, and, you know, we’ve really got a phenomenal asset, and it’s just a matter of locking it, loading it, and putting it back in.”

Maloney reminded the CAPC of some of the talent that has played at The Aud in its nearly 100 years. B.B. King, Ray Charles and Willie Nelson were some of the stars mentioned who have performed in Eureka Springs.

“I think BB King played one of his last concerts before he died in Eureka Springs if it was not the last overall. I’m not sure, but it was one of the last ones for sure,” Schmid said.

END OF YEAR LOOKS BRIGHT

Recent numbers in Airbnb and Vrbo business indicate a strong October and what should be a great end to the year as far as collections, Maloney said.

“The indications are very strong for the fall,” he said. “I checked out the license plates in the parking lot today. Here we go: New York, New Hampshire, Virginia, Kentucky, Illinois, Louisiana, Colorado, Kansas, New Mexico, Iowa, Minnesota, and Arkansas, Oklahoma, Missouri and Texas. Those were just the ones out in the front lot today, so we have plenty of people coming into town.

“We know that these are strong indications that, because of the fall in particular, we should have a banner fall, I hope, unless things just go completely in the tank. I don’t think that they will. But, on the same token, we are seeing marked improvement in the numbers from a year ago at the same time.”

MEETING DATE CHANGES

Because of conflicts at The Aud, the CAPC’s next regular monthly meeting will be held at 5 p.m. Wednesday, Oct. 29.

The next workshop is scheduled for 5 p.m. Wednesday, Nov. 12, and the following regular meeting will be held Thursday, Nov. 20 because of Thanksgiving.